Massive Signals

In this episode, we sit down with Zeb King, Managing Director of Endeavor Colorado — the local chapter of a 45-market global network that backs growth-stage founders through mentorship and a rules-based co-investment fund. Zeb makes the case for Colorado as a genuine global leader in quantum, space, and genomics, not a scaled-down Silicon Valley. We get into why founder-market fit beats revenue as a signal in deep tech, why Colorado's real gap is late-stage capital, and what it's like to sit in front of a global selection panel.
 
In this episode:
The SaaS-pocalypse: Why AI has hollowed out software's moat while deep tech's manufacturing and IP moats have never been more defensible. 
Giving Away Half the Upside, Still Beating the Market: Endeavor's 50-50 profit-sharing fund splits carry with LPs and still nets a top-quartile return. 
The Unanimous Vote: Inside the three-day Athens selection panel, where a founder needs a 6-0 vote to join the network. 
Revenue Is a Lagging Indicator: Endeavor weighs customer concentration and government-funding runway over raw ARR growth. 
Planting the Flag: How Zeb repositioned Endeavor Colorado around quantum and space — and why international companies are now opening Boulder and Denver offices instead of the reverse.
 
Connect more with Zeb King | Endeavor Colorado
Website: https://www.endeavorcolorado.org/ 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/zebking 
 
Connect more with Massive Signals
Website: https://massive.vc/ 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/arinewman 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidgmandell

In this episode, we sit down with Liz Dennett, CEO and Founder of Endolith, a mining technology company using microbes to pull more copper out of the low-grade ore already sitting inside existing mines. Liz makes the case for why mining moves slower than any industry she's touched, why revenue is easy to chase for the wrong reasons in deep tech, and why the world needs more copper by 2050 than humanity has produced in all of history. We also get into her seed-to-Series-A arc, the rule that shaped her cap table, and the discipline of learning what to say no to.
 
In this episode:
 
The "Disprove This" Moment: How Liz stress-tested Endolith's first big validation data — replotting it in Python, asking ChatGPT to poke holes in her own results — before it became the industry's watershed proof point. 
Earning the Right to Operate: Mining companies are risk-averse by design; winning them over takes repeated, boring, safe proof — not one flashy pilot. 
The Copper Cliff: The world needs more copper by 2050 than in all of human history — turning a commodity into a national security issue. 
The Charisma Saving Throw: How a seed round built on vibes and early validation became a WSJ-covered Series A, 18 months later. 
Revenue Is a Lagging Indicator: Why chasing quick five- and six-figure contracts can quietly derail a deep tech company — and why saying no is the discipline.
Connect more with Liz Dennett | Endolith
Website: https://www.endolithmining.com/ 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/microbes 
 
Connect more with Massive Signals
Website: https://massive.vc/ 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/arinewman 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidgmandell

In this episode, we sit down with Leo Polovets, co-founder of Humba Ventures, a fund built around the physical, hard-tech problems most investors avoid. Leo makes the case for why deep tech finally became investable around 2020, why revenue is the wrong milestone to underwrite in hardware, and why non-dilutive funding is a tool founders too often misuse. We also get into what separates real moat-building from just chasing government pilots, and why Humba’s five-year track record is starting to prove the category out.
 
In this episode:
 
Why 2020 Changed the Math: How falling hardware costs and a wave of engineers spinning out of SpaceX and Tesla convinced Leo it was finally the right time to leave software behind.
No Pivoting From Reactors to Satellites: Why a great deep tech founder can’t switch technologies the way a software founder pivots from a dating app to a video app.
Grants Aren’t Revenue: How founders can rack up pilots and government contracts and still miss the one thing that actually proves a business — real, converting demand.
The Numbers Don’t Lie: Why Humba’s fund one is tracking at 2X with 60% of seed companies reaching Series A, versus an industry average closer to 20%.
Single Customer Risk, Rewritten: Why a government contract that would spook a software investor is often the strongest signal of product-market fit in deep tech.
 
Connect more with Leo Polovets | Humba Ventures
Website: https://humbaventures.com/ 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lpolovets  
 
Connect more with Massive Signals
Website: https://massive.vc/ 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/arinewman 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidgmandell

In this episode, we sit down with Jon Bronson, co-founder of J2 Ventures, the firm investing at the intersection of deep tech and national security. Jon shares how a PhD chemist and a military intelligence officer became co-founders, why “dual use” gets misapplied as a euphemism for failed commercial ventures, and how non-dilutive government funding can extend a startup’s runway without ever counting as real revenue. We cover the founding myths LPs used to believe about defense investing, the SPV grind before launching a fund, and why quantum computing is where J2 is placing its long-term bets.
In this episode:
 
An Unlikely Partnership: How a PhD chemist and a military intelligence officer became co-founders — and why their fights are the point.
Dual Use, Properly Defined: Why most “dual use” pitches are failed commercial plays in disguise.
Money That Isn’t Revenue: Why J2 doesn’t count government grants as revenue, and how to spot real validation versus an outsourced lab.
The Pivot That Worked: How a wearable already making $1 million a year got shelved entirely — and why the founder was right to do it.
Budgets That Never Go Down: Why non-weapons defense spending survives every administration change, regardless of politics.​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​
Connect more with Jon Bronson | J2 Ventures
 
Website: https://www.j2vp.com 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonathanbronson  
Connect more with Massive Signals
 
Website: https://massive.vc/ 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/arinewman 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidgmandell

In this episode, we sit down with Scott Davis, CEO and co-founder of Vescent Technologies, a quantum infrastructure company selling into nearly every corner of the quantum ecosystem. Scott makes the case for why three of the four quantum computing modalities run on Vescent's photonics, how close we actually are to a "Q-Day" that could break modern encryption, and why GPS may be the more urgent vulnerability. We also get into what it actually took to move Vescent from a garage project into full-scale production, and why Colorado quietly became the country's only place-based quantum tech hub.
 
In this episode:
 
Picks, Shovels, and Photons: How a photonics side hustle became the tech most quantum computers now run on — and why Vescent bets across all four modalities. 
Is Q-Day Real?: Why commercial viability likely hits years before quantum computers can crack RSA encryption. 
The Vulnerability Nobody Talks About: How a 50-watt signal from thousands of miles up quietly runs our grid, phones, and financial trades. 
Foundations Before Rooftop Decks: Why the hardest part of deep tech isn't the invention — it's the grind to production. 
Colorado's Quantum Advantage: How the state became the only place-based quantum tech hub, and what that means for the industry's next decade.
 
Connect more with Scott Davis | Vescent
Website: https://vescent.com/ 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/scott-davis-89494a7 
 
Connect more with Massive Signals
Website: https://massive.vc/ 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/arinewman 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidgmandell

In this episode, we sit down with Vrajesh Bhavsar, founder and CEO of Operant AI, a platform built to protect AI agents, cloud workloads, and MCP ecosystems at runtime. Vrajesh traces his path from Apple’s Secure Enclave to Arm’s ML business unit to the founding bet that security couldn’t scale on dashboards and human intervention alone. We cover how early design partners forced Operant’s focus, what it cost to break into cyber as an outsider, and how a Kubernetes-native foundation became the right architecture for a world that didn’t exist yet. We also get into the pricing model they figured out before the SaaS world caught up, what it meant when seven people showed up to the first enterprise demo call, and why agentic identity is the most overhyped category in AI security right now.
In this episode:
 
The Early Vision Problem: Operant started broad — it took real customer feedback to force the security focus that made everything else possible.
The Outsider Tax: Breaking into cyber without a Palo Alto or Zscaler pedigree was hard, and Vrajesh doesn’t pretend otherwise.
The Kubernetes Bet: Most enterprises weren’t sure Kubernetes would matter. Operant built their entire foundation on it anyway.
The Pricing Call: They built utility-based pricing before seat-based SaaS came under pressure — and the market caught up to them.
Seven People on the First Call: When enterprises started showing up to demos with full teams and no foot-dragging, the inflection point had arrived.
Connect more with Vrajesh Bhavsar | Operant AI
 
Website: https://www.operant.ai 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/vrajeshio 
Connect more with Massive Signals
 
Website: https://massive.vc/ 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/arinewman 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidgmandell

In this episode, we sit down with Kelly Coyne, investor at D4 Investments, a firm going all-in on quantum after years backing industrial robotics. Kelly shares how she went from dismissing quantum on stage at the School of Mines to making it her entire investment focus three months later. We cover why being wrong is a competitive advantage in venture, how geography determines your entire quantum thesis, and why the mega fund shift has quietly opened up a lane for smaller investors. We also get into the laser vs. fabrication cost divide, what near-term revenue actually looks like in quantum today, and why the tipping point everyone’s waiting for is already too late for early-stage investors.
 
What we cover:
The Wrong-on-Stage Reversal: Kelly dismissed quantum publicly in summer 2025 and was all-in by October. Why that kind of flip is a feature, not a flaw.
The Robotics Lesson: First mover traps, customer-first thinking, and why moving fast breaks things in hardware.
The Quantum Primer: What Q-Day actually is, why RSA encryption is the real stakes, and why quantum isn’t as new as people think.
The Mega Fund Gap: Why the shift toward large funds has created a real opening for smaller, earlier investors.
The Geography Filter: Why quantum is the most geographically locked technology Kelly has ever seen — and why it’s her first filter in any pitch.
The Near-Term Revenue Thesis: Components, sensing, timing, simulation — why she’s backing these over full-stack compute, with Vescent and Icarus as real examples.
The Laser vs. Fab Divide: Why laser-based approaches cost less to get to market — and what that means for early-stage bets.​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​ 
Connect more with Kelly Coyne | D4 Investments
 
Website: https://www.d4investments.com/ 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellykcoyne  
Connect more with Massive Signals
 
Website: https://massive.vc/ 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/arinewman 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidgmandell

In this episode, we sit down with Andrew Antonio, founder and CEO of Urban Sky, the company treating the stratosphere like the final frontier it actually is. Andrew shares how a world-record skydive from 136,000 feet planted the seed, why the stratosphere has been ignored for 60 years while space and aviation absorbed all the capital, and how getting their butts kicked in the imagery market led to a defense breakthrough that changed the entire company. We cover reusable balloon economics, the one-button engineering philosophy, co-founder dynamics as a literal marriage, and why a global constellation of stratospheric balloons isn’t science fiction.
In this episode:
 
The Ignored Frontier: Why the stratosphere sits forgotten between commercial aviation and space — and why no one solved its core problems for 60 years.
Satellite in a Backpack: One person, one button, under 10 minutes — how Urban Sky reimagined stratospheric deployment from the ground up.
Getting Their Butts Kicked: Why a 2X better imagery product loses every time against five-year satellite contracts — and what it actually feels like when a market isn’t working.
The Defense Flip: When defense customers showed up and everything felt effortless — the moment Andrew knew he’d been swimming against the current.
Co-Founder as Marriage: The Biosphere 2 advice that took years to internalize — disagree hard in the room, walk out completely aligned.
The Fundraising Reality: Why the Series A was the real lift, what changed by Series B, and how Altos got to conviction on a category that didn’t exist yet.​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​
Connect more with Andrew Antonio | Urban Sky
 
Website: https://urbansky.com 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrewfantonio 
Connect more with Massive Signals
 
Website: https://massive.vc/ 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/arinewman 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidgmandell

In this episode, we sit down with Aziz Gilani, general partner of Houston-based Mercury Fund, which manages over $750 million focused on disruptive technology startups outside Silicon Valley. Aziz shares his journey from intern to partner, Mercury's renewed focus on deep tech, and why incumbents across industries have never been more vulnerable to disruption. We dive deep into what separates tourists from true players in frontier tech, the scars from the 2008-2010 cleantech boom, and why the convergence of software and hardware is creating the most exciting hunting ground for venture capital in decades.
In this episode:
 
The "Fresh Sheet" Era: The "cookie-cutter" SaaS playbook is dead; the new game is building net-new companies from a fresh sheet of paper. 
Hunting Brittle Incumbents: Stagnant players in defense and energy are now vulnerable to rapid, deep-tech disruption. 
The "CFO Top 5" Rule: You must solve one of a CFO's top five most urgent problems or you'll never survive the switching costs. 
No Room for Tourists: Success requires a founder’s "right to win" through deep technical moats rather than surface-level industry interest. 
The Power of Non-Consensus: The biggest winners are found in contrarian picks, not in deals where the entire partnership immediately agrees.
Connect more with Aziz Gilani | Mercury Fund
 
Website: https://mercuryfund.com/ 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/texasvc/ 
Connect more with Massive Signals
 
Website: https://massive.vc/ 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/arinewman 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidgmandell

In this episode, we sit down with Kevin Noertker, co-founder and CEO of Ampaire, a company building hybrid electric propulsion and onboard power systems for existing aircraft. Kevin shares his path from NASA JPL to a $200M aerospace program to the lunch pitch that changed everything. We cover why Ampaire bet on retrofits over clean-sheet designs, how a Hawaiian airport killed their plug-in strategy, and what happened when a signed $10M term sheet quietly became $250K. We also get into the SPAC they walked away from, the 18 months they ran cashflow breakeven, and why the most credible path to electric aviation looks nothing like the hype.
In this episode:
 
The Customer Discovery Signal: One airline CEO's offhand question redirected Ampaire's entire product strategy. 
The Infrastructure Reality Check: A single charger install in Hawaii took nine months and killed the plug-in roadmap. 
The SPAC Inflection Point: Kevin saw the market turning before most and walked away while he still could. 
The Ghost Term Sheet: A $10M commitment became $250K — and what that taught him about founder integrity. 
The Default Alive Moment: When the raise fell through, they ran lean for 18 months and came out stronger. 
One Engine, Three Markets: The same core technology unlocks commercial, defense, and regional jet revenue — without losing focus. 
Connect more with Kevin Noertker | Ampaire
 
Website: https://www.ampaire.com/ 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kevinnoertker 
Connect more with Massive Signals
 
Website: https://massive.vc/ 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/arinewman 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidgmandell